Take a minute and read this.

[ArielTheShadow]

So last night me and a friend were exploring in New Nantes. I searched a chest and found a (unidentified) Axe. I took it to town and had it identified. It was a Dwarven Axe with some bonuses. So I used it as my primary weapon all the way till the next day. Then I get a strange message from a DM, asking me where I found the weapon. So I explained, I was exploring in the Goblin Caves and found it in a chest. So this DM tells me that such items do not exist in Hala, it is too powerful. (Although I found it, have it in my inventory and have been running around all day with it). So I ask the DM, well I did find it in a fair manner, and have always been a respectful player towards others, can't I just keep it? The whole point of going on adventures and exploring caves is in hopes of finding something worthwhile. Kinda makes the game pointless if everytime we find something good we must fear loosing it at the hands of the DM's. So the DM changes the Dwarven Axe to a Greataxe+1. I found this item in a fair manner, didn't take it from an NPC or other player. I then get it taken away leaving me with an empty feeling. Why? This is the point of the game, finding powerful weapons and armor so our next exploration in the game might be safer than the last. Before in Hala I looked at every crossroad as a journey, an adventure. Now when I look, I see a cardboard cut out world of very limited possibilties. Us as players invest alot of time into your game, it takes the fun out the game when you (DM's) take back after we've given so much. -----Ariel The Shadow-----

[Psye Shaar]

The axe was removed because it was an illegal drop. A mistake. To allow you to have kept it would have been unfair on the rest of the playerbase as they would have had no chance of finding such an item themselves.

You are not the first person that has had an item removed on Hala or any other COPAP world and most certainly won't be the last. We can't address mistakes unless they are brought to our attention and this requires honesty on the part of the players when something is OBVIOUSLY wrong.

To obtain higher level items requires either trading with other players, crafting (to an extent) or getting involved in dm plots, which may then ~earn~ you better items as rewards.

If it's obvious something is wrong, then notify the team. If you're not sure, you can pm any of us to ask and we'll get back to you as soon as we can.

[Jskee]

-----Ariel The Shadow-----,
It's happened to my character as well and it was an item that my character had wanted for a long long time. I reported it to the team when it happened and Arkon researched it and then ended up taking the item. Sure I felt disappointed, but to get an item that shouldn't have dropped in the first place isn't fair to the rest of the players. I'm sorry you found the nice axe to begin with however making comments such as:

Before in Hala I looked at every crossroad as a journey, an adventure. Now when I look, I see a cardboard cut out world of very limited possibilties. Us as players invest alot of time into your game, it takes the fun out the game when you (DM's) take back after we've given so much.

This isn't going to bring the axe back. The team here put in long hours and volunteer their time so that you and I can enjoy this place. Before you found the axe everything was rosy, now Hala is the suxxor because a DM ensured that the playing field remain level by removing the axe from your chars inventory? I think you're missing the whole point of a Role Playing game. Also, I think you owe the Team here an apology, but that's just my opinion.

Good luck to you in the future and I hope things get better for you.

J

[Arkon]

There are rules posted about ISDs

ISD = Illegal Static Drop

An illegal static drop is an item that violates the articles in it's power dropping from a creature or being found in a chest. It is incumbent upon the character finding such an item to report it immediately to the team of the world it is found on.

This is and always has been in the rules of CoPaP/Hala

If anything, our DM was nice. You could have been banned for not reporting the illegal drop.

FYI. Look here for the CoPaP Ruling on Illegal Static Drop

[Dengar]

I as Amash have never found one... But My old Character Dengar (which I am sure the DMs remember this) found two... I had to give them up... I hated to, but, it was a bogus glich in the system.

[Primal Lotus]

In the post referenced by Arkon it states, ". . .you should never get items of +1 or greater enchancement bonus, or greater value than 1000 gp." Is this definition still in effect?

Removed weird space between the "y" and "o" in the word "you".

[Psye Shaar]

In the post referenced by Arkon it states, ". . .y ou should never get items of +1 or greater enchancement bonus, or greater value than 1000 gp." Is this definition still in effect?

No.

There are occasional +2 items out there (one considerably more frequent that is found all over) and GP value will vary from merchant to merchant, but is not restricted to 1000.

As I said in my original reply, the type of drops such as the one in the original post are OBVIOUSLY not a standard palette drop and so should be reported to the team a.s.a.p.

If you're ever unsure, just ask.

[Alias Ironjade]

As I was the DM that handled the object in question, it was EXCEEDINGLY obvious that the weapon was far and beyond anything the player had found on Hala.

1. They were either unaware of the item drop policy (guilty of not reading the server rules)

OR

2. They knew the rules (guilty of not abiding by the server rules)


Simple solution: When in doubt, ask a team member!!

It save a lot of heartburn all the way around.

Alias

[Meredia]

I know it can seem unfair when you find something like that and it turns out that you can't keep it because of a rule. But as it was stated above, it wouldn't be fair to the rest of the player base, for whom such an item would either be A) unattainable by normal methods of game play, or B) go about on a long and winding road of hassle in trying to acquire/purchase such an item.

There are always unlimited possibilities on servers that are run by real people for real people. If you are looking for a better weapon, you can always post on the IC boards about it, and get both player as well as possibly DM responses to what you post. You can make initiatives on your part in character for things that you wish, and allow the world to dynamically respond to you. But attaining such a fine axe by a bug would spoil all the fun you can have in working in character to get what you desire.

Live it up and have a blast! So long as we're all playing fair, everyone's got a shot at greatness.

[Dengar]

The Fact is... is that even though you have found this axe, and even though you got away with running around with it, The DMs do not accept this axe as a part of hala... when Dengar showed up in Hala with +3 longswords... the were quickly taken away... at first I was angry as hell, as I played on... I got it... no one had such weapons... nor did anyone on hala have the chance to find, or buy such a weapon. anything above a +1 (as far as experience of playing goes) must come from a higher level, and more worldly character, or a DM, mainly through an event... even those are few and far between...

As I can explain it, the DMs do this, simply to keep everythingt balanced...

Psye Shaar and I had a disscusion on this topic. (OOC when he came to the states)

Weapons like that, should not be attainable through a chest in a random dungeon.

Should they be attainable? Maybe, if the actions and RP so prove to be worth such an Item...
Will it ever happen here in Hala... doubtful.

Unless there is a good RP, and DM reason to give such an Item...
No one of less than maximum level will ever attain such an Item.

Hala, is not here for powerhungry characters to prey on the weak... nor for a low level guy to get thier ass handed to them (unless RP provokes such an action)... Hala is a world, where the good and the evil fight to bring themselves above the chaos!

Anyone who has played here more than a year can tell you that.

I enjoy Hala, as does everyone I know... Ariel, I know you have too... Don't let this one minor thing ruin it for you...

If you do that, you would not know this place exsisted... Your friends, and thier friends would have never brought you here, Never told you about Hala... Alas, if you want to blame the DM's for a script bug... by all means... but think before you leave.

Stay awhile... you might understand it, Like I did

Dengar "tha meetsheeld" Kegbuster
Amash of Blackbard
Siva Oblodra So'Riatin
Dimwick "the halfling" Dappapallo
"Bee"

[Psye Shaar]

Psye Shaar and I had a disscusion on this topic. (OOC when he came to the states)

Weapons like that, should not be attainable through a chest in a random dungeon.

Should they be attainable? Maybe, if the actions and RP so prove to be worth such an Item...
Will it ever happen here in Hala... doubtful.

Unless there is a good RP, and DM reason to give such an Item...
No one of less than maximum level will ever attain such an Item.

Just to clarify here...

While in essence the statement is correct, the level of a PC is only a part of the reasoning behind items that are given to them.

Basically, when a DM gives out rewards for plots, there will always be a number of factors taken into account (in no particular order):

The class of the PC - Each class has it's relevant stats - Rogue: Dex, Wizard: Int etc, etc

The nature of the plot leading up to the reward - Rewards can be reflective of those giving them out: If you save a library from certain doom, they don't tend to have swords lying around...

The level of the PC: There are ranges of levels where certain levels of equipment are more suited and likely to be found, but these are only guidelines and not fixed. A level 30 PC that rarely RP's or gets involved in plots at all will likely still only be wearing store bought or traded items. A level 15 PC that makes a point of becoming fully immersed in the world could well have numerous custom made or more powerful items. Things like this have to be earned. They're not simply given out because you managed to kill 'x' amount of creatures or you've now reached 'x' level.

The depth of the RP shown by the PC in the plot -
The effort put into the plot by the player (boardwork etc) - These two (IMO) are the biggest factors in the decisions made in what rewards are given. DM's talk to each other, so we know who RP's a lot and who RP's by convenience. We also know who puts the effort into plots and their characters. I'm not talking about time here. Not everyone has as much time to play, but it's how that time is spent while in-game that's important.

There are more, but every DM and every plot is different.

The overall point that i'm trying to make is that while items are nice and often very useful, if your only reason for playing is items alone, then to be honest, you're extremely unlikely to get your hands on anything 'special' at all.

Hala is an RP server and as such, the greatest rewards will be gained by those that make the effort to RP.

[Themicles]

Here are the rules on Item Balance if Orleron's post, linked earlier in this thread, was not clear:
http://www.copap.org/portal.php?getpage ... #article32

Keep in mind that Illegal Static Drop means *static*.

Examples:

• Lizardmen that drop +1 spears each and every time you kill one.
• A chest that spawns the same +3 item every single time it's looted (either once per server reset or multiple times per server reset).
• A piece of +1 armor on the ground in a death plane that's there once per reset.

Please keep in mind the key term here, "static".

The random loot system is allowed to spawn +1 or even +2 gear at random. It wont happen except for higher level characters, but it's allowed. If Hala/Ysgard use the random treasure system that was available to CoPaP, then anywhere from level 12 and up might have a decent chance at finding a +1 item in a random loot drop. Epics may find themselves coming across +2 items here or there, though rarely.

Simply put, if you find, for example, a +2 item in a chest, and it's there again after the reset: report it. It's not an intended drop, and is illegal under the CoPaP Articles.

[Jskee]

My character has found literally hundreds of +5 rings.







They all add +5 to his Lore and have light that emits from them.

[Shadowstalker74]

My character has found literally hundreds of +5 rings.







They all add +5 to his Lore and have light that emits from them.

Dang...




*stabs jskee's character in the foot and steals all his +5 rings*

[T'Holoth Shadowborn]

Understanding the rule isn't up for negeotiation,

personally I've killed dragons and for my effort have been awarded a healing kit and 20 gold. Same goes for more difficult monsters.

I don't see allowing someone to keep a +2 or +3 item as a reward all together game unbalancing.

[Lord Droke]

Magic items can cause unbalancing issues.
Years ago when i regularly ran pnp events for my friends, we had a set of books for 2nd edition. These books contained over 4 million items or something like that, with huge tables to role on to randomly generate an item in the book. Now at the time, I was like hell yeah and went item crazy, got the stuff they found in dragons hoards lol. This quickly through everything out of whack. I had to constantly up the lvl of the attacking creatures to provide a challenge more then I should have. The pcs in these sessions became way to powerful and none were even close high lvls yet. After that I learned my lessons about items. They are rare, and they are rare for a reason. In the FR campaign setting for example (the whole thing) I believe there is only one magical item shop.

Ariel please keep in mind that the weapon should never have been there in the first place, the game glitched and that weapon was born. The rule of thumb should be if you ever find an item on a npc or in a chest that is above a +2 (and the only +2 items I have found this way I believe are natural armour so anything better then a +1 is questionable) and you are not in a dm event then it is a game glitch, it should be reported and the item trashed.

Uber items can make a character a lot stronger then they should be at there given lvl. You put a +3 vorpal weapon, with regeneration on it in the hands of 7th lvl char and guess what? Although they only have 7 Hit Dice they are going places I wouldn't go with my char that has 26 Hit Dice. Does that sound right to you?

Ariel, don't let this get you down. You are still new to Hala and CoPap and I don't care what anybody says, when you first start is impossible to know all the rules. This is probably why the item was just simply taken away, as opposed to you being banned or vault jailed or whatever. The best advice I could give you would be don't worry so much about finding better gear and worry more about developing your characters personality through interaction with other pc's. If you do that the DM's will be giving you the better gear and some xp while there at it.

[Lassarra Dal'Me'Ton]

I think it's all depending on what the axe was and what it's attribute's were. If hala is spiting out yet again random powerfull equipment to any joe blow character at any lvl there's a problem someplace. If it was just a +3 battleaxe and the dm removed it from you because they claim a +3 won't drop.. umm yeah i think the Dm in question overeacted in the claim's, a +3 won't drop because they will.. a rareity but they will still drop if you got a hell of a horse shoe up your whoha. The ticket is reporting the drop, which is what you did wrong, sure the server spit it out, it's not your fault it spit it out ( ie you weren't cheating /scamming in anyway) but you just assumed that you could keep it and continued on with glee untill a Dm showed up asking question's, it only took one a day before noticing. Next time report as soon as it happen's, they may still take said item from you as per rule's, but they'll reward the honesty better.
Didn't you know that Dm's are infomation glutten's? especially high drop information glutten's? You can have a character 4 year's old with reported ubber item's and you'll alway's find a new DM who's never seen your character with such item's, come info hunting on when why what's and how's. They also appreciate having report's immediatly they help cut down on time to fix / reset to be fixed if needed, the problem pinpointed quicker. It's thier Job's some of them take it a bit further than they should but as long as your honest giving them the beinfit of the doubt no harm get's done and realising that you could have just let 30 other's get said item by not reporting the drop for two day's pisses them off a bit too
As per the Copap rule's on item drop's in my honest opinion it need's to be rewriten, as to have no doubt what when and where, isd's and random drop's that do occur legally and illegally can and can't be kept or considered even keepable,so the average new player ( within the last year or two) know what when and how something shouldn't be happening, the rule of common sence should never have been implemented on something that can be taken out of common sence..
eg, player A just signed up a month ago, read the rule's , has a common sence grasp on what should and shouldn't drop but, have played in a uber like enviroment for the past two year's before joining, to us uber is +3 and up, to player A a +3 with one elemental type damage on it isn't uber it's lower than the +10 with 1d whatever uber they've gotten before in past server's, and have seen such a weapon weilded by another longer term player. So they feel that it's not worth worrying about reporting and feel like they can keep said item.
To the average player the rule should state, AS per item 's droping in a dm event, static drop's and random loot/monster drop's, we as a server have no intention of such item's in this list of ever droping ( imput item's considered uber to your server here) And reserve the right to remove said item's at anytime within reason.( condition's stated here, item a custom, item a dm reward, plot item's, off world item's etc. )Common sence shouldn't be put in at anytime because each person's grasp on common sence for a video game is different especially when it come's down to Item's power.


Savagej

Long day sorry for the rambling!! lol